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 Post subject: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sat 06 Jun 2015, 01:12 
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Well it's been talked about for years and it's finally happened - I have added 3D models to Mutant Factions! I still have plenty more work to do but I can finally show you some really cool looking screenshots of these models in action. What I've done so far is created all the code necessary for loading up models, all the map editor stuff is done allowing you to position, rotate, scale and save models into your maps. I've also managed to get these models showing up properly in-game. Not only do they show up, but I've also applied the new specularity and shadow casting technologies to them as well. As a result these models really appear as if they're actually there in 3D in the game. Looks very cool I think!

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I've also made it so players can create THEIR OWN models and place them in the data/models/ folder. Just export a standard .obj file and place it in the folder. I've also created a new special texture file that we can use to texture these models properly. I will still have to check any models and textures that are added, but I'm sure there are plenty of amazing graphical artists out there who would love to finally be able to add something as detailed and interesting as their very own 3D model to the game. So if you know much about 3D modelling and texturing please go nuts!

The next steps for me are to actually create a whole bunch more of these models and make them look extra sexy. As mentioned above if you want to help be my guest! Otherwise I would love ideas on what sort of models we should add. So far all I've done is create a very quick and dirty stop sign and streetlight. More ideas people! The more models we have the more rich and detailed our maps are going to look.

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Now a few notes on the models. They are PURELY cosmetic. The whole point of adding this is simply to make the game look better and more professional, which will help us market and sell the game to potential new players. They have no impact on gameplay and this means you can walk right through them. Ghost models! I am still deciding if it's a good idea to make these models colldable. It could be cool, but it could also be annoying.

Thoughts are welcome. Most importantly though the models look very cool... and very sexxxy ;)

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sat 06 Jun 2015, 01:41 
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fap fap fap

But seriously, those look awesome! Imo, make them player collideable but bullets can pass through. Because they look as if they don't take up a whole space. I'd love to play a few games with models first though to see how they feel to play around before making any decisions though.
Add tree/bushes models too.

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sat 06 Jun 2015, 02:13 
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Nightfall wrote:
But seriously, those look awesome! Imo, make them player collideable but bullets can pass through. Because they look as if they don't take up a whole space. I'd love to play a few games with models first though to see how they feel to play around before making any decisions though.
Add tree/bushes models too.

Actually the collision issue is important. If my model is a huge tree or even a bridge, then I would expect it to block both bullets and players and I won't want to use the map editor's tile collision because it is not precise. If my model is meant to be a decorative street lamp hanging from the wall, then I certainly don't want players to collide (not to mention the mess that is bridge aiming), and perhaps by extension bullets.

Since Bence said this is purely decorative though, I would say it does feel really weird for such a giant lamp post to be passable and be mistaken for a proper wall, maybe make the column less thick.

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sat 06 Jun 2015, 05:00 
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Suggestions for 3D models which would help so much, assuming that some of these 3d models have the possibility of being collideable:

Handrails
Pipe sections
Trees
Hanging wires (currently we do have wires made via decals, but they don't hang and it looks like a stick)
Barrels (singular and on pallets)
Trash! Junk! Destroyed wall segments! Destroyed vehicles!
Wall-hung and standing computer screens
Industrial metal balconies (if not able to be collideable, at least to look nice on certain industrial maps)
Furniture such as: Chairs, Couches, Tables, Lamps, etc.

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sat 06 Jun 2015, 10:14 
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when are you gonna add 3d player models?


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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sat 06 Jun 2015, 18:24 
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Qwertybeef wrote:
Suggestions for 3D models which would help so much, assuming that some of these 3d models have the possibility of being collideable:

Handrails
Pipe sections
Trees
Hanging wires (currently we do have wires made via decals, but they don't hang and it looks like a stick)
Barrels (singular and on pallets)
Trash! Junk! Destroyed wall segments! Destroyed vehicles!
Wall-hung and standing computer screens
Industrial metal balconies (if not able to be collideable, at least to look nice on certain industrial maps)
Furniture such as: Chairs, Couches, Tables, Lamps, etc.


Excellent suggestions. You remind me of Jesus right now.


STM1993 wrote:
Actually the collision issue is important. If my model is a huge tree or even a bridge, then I would expect it to block both bullets and players and I won't want to use the map editor's tile collision because it is not precise. If my model is meant to be a decorative street lamp hanging from the wall, then I certainly don't want players to collide (not to mention the mess that is bridge aiming), and perhaps by extension bullets.

Since Bence said this is purely decorative though, I would say it does feel really weird for such a giant lamp post to be passable and be mistaken for a proper wall, maybe make the column less thick.


So my main concern with collision is how it will affect gameplay. If for example you collide with the side of the lamppost, then you must be able to collide with the top of the lamppost as well. In which case you could jump ontop of it from the building above it. Now this sounds cool but I don't think it would actually work with our top-down view. Same reason we don't have bridge. If someone is standing ontop of the model and someone directly underneath it, how do you choose which player to shoot at? You can't, and that's a huge game-breaking issue. As a result I think it's easier to just make nothing collidable, keeping gameplay exactly the same without introducing any of these issues. If MF was an FPS I'd make them collidable for sure, but I think we just have to accept the limitations of the top-down view. The top-down view allows us to have all sorts of awesome gameplay elements not found in FPS, but running along bridge and jumping on top of models unfortunately isn't one of them.

As for it feeling weird to walk through a model, I think we'll get used to it. Lots of games have these weird things that players just accept. They're just here to make the screenshots and youtube videos look sexier. If we're going to sell Mutant Factions to the mass market the game needs to look polished and professional, and I think the changes I'm making here and with the lighting really help do that! (of course it means I'll have to make yet another gameplay youtube video).

Maximilian wrote:
when are you gonna add 3d player models?


I want the player models and vehicles to look really good, so they might take some time. So what I'm going to do is finish off anything related to map-making first then release a new version. Would be nice to try out some of these new chemical and balance suggestions we've been discussing lately too. Then map makers will have a chance to experiment with all the new changes in lighting and models and maybe even make some models of their own. While you guys are doing this I'll move on to the player and vehicle models.

God DAMN it's going to look so good. I always knew I'd have 3D models eventually but it's cool to actually see the day arrive. This sort of thing will REALLY help bring back old players when I start marketing too. Despite the countless changes and improvments to gameplay over the years, people mostly just judge a game by how it looks. When all the old players receive an email from me with this completely redesigned look (along with the inclusion of chemical warfare) we should be able to get a lot of them back just in time for the Steam release.

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sat 06 Jun 2015, 22:46 
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Not having collision seems a bit not polished. ;p We should try it before making any observations though I'm not decided yet I want to see first.

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sun 07 Jun 2015, 01:56 
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Yeah but did you read my post? What can we actually do if someone is standing on top of a model? How can you choose to shoot at them or the person below them? There just isn't a way to do that with the current top-down system, and I don't think there's any way to change it without it becoming waaay too confusing.

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sun 07 Jun 2015, 02:19 
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bencelot wrote:
Yeah but did you read my post? What can we actually do if someone is standing on top of a model? How can you choose to shoot at them or the person below them? There just isn't a way to do that with the current top-down system, and I don't think there's any way to change it without it becoming waaay too confusing.

Is it possible to create collision on only certain parts of a model? If it were a lamp post, only have collision on the vertical part, and have it be infinite (Like collision'd tiles.) People shouldn't be jumping over stop signs and lamp posts in most maps anyways, so they'll should never encounter hitting them with bullets from above them if the map maker does things right...

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sun 07 Jun 2015, 02:43 
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The vertically infinite idea is a good one as it fixes the aiming issue, but then it has other problems. For example, you would have this random invisible wall if you did just so happen to try jump off a building and over a lamp post. Secondly, what about a railing or a box or something. Either that has infinite vertical collision meaning you can't jump over the railing, or we have to go back to no collision on the railing and we're right back at square one again.. it's a tricky one, but I'm thinking just no collision.

I say we simply leave it up to the map makers to not put massive models right in the middle of a walkway. Put models where you normally won't be walking, like up high or tucked away in a corner somewhere. That way 95% of the time no one is going to run through them anyway, and when they do well.. everyone just knows you can go through models in MF. Not uncommon to see this in other games too.

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sun 07 Jun 2015, 02:47 
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I mentioned before on chatbox that it would be nice if you could make invisible tiles. Basically collision with adjustable height instead of infinite height.

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sun 07 Jun 2015, 03:17 
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Added hanging wires and railings today. God damn this is cool! It's so easy to make these simple models and yet they add so much detail to the map. Double detail because not only does the model look cool but the shadow it casts adds detail to the map as well! Loving it :D

Attachment:
railings2.jpg
railings2.jpg [ 343.11 KiB | Viewed 2268 times ]

Attachment:
railings1.jpg
railings1.jpg [ 276.86 KiB | Viewed 2268 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sun 07 Jun 2015, 03:59 
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bencelot wrote:
Yeah but did you read my post? What can we actually do if someone is standing on top of a model? How can you choose to shoot at them or the person below them? There just isn't a way to do that with the current top-down system, and I don't think there's any way to change it without it becoming waaay too confusing.

Yeh definitely possible issues with that (actually definitely definite issues) but no collision at all is weird. I like Qwerts idea that some parts of models never have collision. But there should be a toggle for them so you could have a bush or something have collision or not.
And bence make it so that if a mutant is covered by decals/models their name/number isn't visible to enemies unless sonar/radar. So hard to make hidey-holes/secret areas. :(

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sun 07 Jun 2015, 16:09 
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I'm thinking of just removing that number to be honest. No one ever looks at it and the info is in the scoretab. Might replace it with a health indicator for yourself and allies (not enemies). THOUGHTS????????????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1one!!!!!!!!!!

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sun 07 Jun 2015, 18:42 
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yep, good idea.
also, nice screens


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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sun 07 Jun 2015, 19:07 
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bencelot wrote:
I'm thinking of just removing that number to be honest. No one ever looks at it and the info is in the scoretab. Might replace it with a health indicator for yourself and allies (not enemies). THOUGHTS????????????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1one!!!!!!!!!!

Could go with either the raw number over their head.
Or something like this with two rings one for mana one for HP.
Image
Might want ability to turn it on/off though or share with merc allys if you're teamed? idk, there should be some system when you become more than temp partners with a fellow mercenary and are basically on a team. So you can see each others chemicals and health bars and see their position on map?

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Sun 07 Jun 2015, 20:21 
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If/when I actually figure out a good way to do mercenary buddies with proper incentives and whatnot I'll probably enable this feature (and other team features) for the shared mercs too.

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Tue 09 Jun 2015, 04:10 
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Added a few more groovy objects. Barrels, a rounded handrail and a few basic objects that you guys can scale/rotate/colour to build your own stuff from scratch (kinda like how you can build with the 3D decals. Here's how they look with and without the lighting effects. Quite a difference no? I've kept the old lighting in the game becausse it loads faster, and some people might be a bit impatient. In-game performance is basically the same though.

Attachment:
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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Tue 09 Jun 2015, 20:29 
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For those who are interested how this stuff is made:

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 Post subject: Re: 3D Models!! Mutant Factions has finally gone 3D baby!
PostPosted: Wed 10 Jun 2015, 03:03 
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More awesome additions today! We have wooden palettes, metal balconies, debris, barrels and even police tape!! I'm basically going off of Qwerty's excellent suggestions at the moment but I'm almost through with them all. So give me more suggestions! Anything you think would be cool in your maps let me know :)

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